[JDEV] Re: Implementing Jabber Server in other Languages (Was RE: [JDEV] Cus tomizing Jabber server)

[temas]

I personally (and I believe jer too) would love love love to see the
server implemented in other languages.  The more options available the
stronger I can see the growth of Jabber as a whole.  The whole reason we
have a common protocol is so we can have many servers.  Yes, some of the
servers may not scale as well, some might not expose more advanced
functionality, but having a more dynamic server to test on could be
helpful in many scenarios.  Just had to throw in my $0.02

--temas 

On 09 May 2001 14:42:37 -0500, John Hebert wrote:
> 5/9/01 8:03:42 AM, Matt Diez <matt at vedalabs.com> wrote:
> >   I really don't see implementation of Jabber in other
> >   languages as being that practical or necessary. I
> >   must confess, I really don't like changing server code
> >   to change server behavior (registration, I'm looking
> >   at you). But, I really can't see how/when/where/why
> >   a server in, say Python is all that advantageous,
> 
> Quicker to prototype and test new capabilities, for one. Lots
> of XML libs/tools for another. Python works best as a glue
> scripting language between components.
> 
> >   save for its multiplatform capabilities. But, I must
> >   say, given the speed Jabber must work to route messages,
> 
> That's why I mentioned calling C binaries from Python or
> language X if needed. Also, performance may not be a priority.
> I can imagine using the jabber server for other tasks besides
> IM chatting.
> 
> >   I don't see a Python (or any other language of your choice)
> >   server as
> >
> >   a) useful
> >   b) practical
> 
> Oh yeah? Moldy bread.
> 
> >   This demands the inside-out reworking of the Jabber server
> >   in a variety of languages, and the development of alternate
> >   servers that can "anticipate" future changes to Jabber
> >   internal protocols and such.
> 
> Interesting. Kinda like Apache httpd's DSO modules.
> 
> >   Now - the ability to change certain server behaviors does
> >   make itself attractive, and is a pretty compelling argument
> >   for implementing Jabber in other languages, but I'm not
> >   sure there aren't simply better ways around this, particularly
> >   ones that don't require wholesale server rewrite whenever
> >   fundamental changes in the default Jabber server occur.
> 
> I'm getting confused... didn't you just say something to the
> contrary before this? And don't you mean "protocol" instead
> of your last use of "server" in the above paragraph?
> If so, agreed, server rewrites for protocol changes is icky. 
> 
> >   I think the focus of current server developers should be
> >   to first document all internal protocols - (s2s and xdb
> >   being fine examples), and then to worry about making
> >   Jabber as portable as possible. I've got a pretty hefty
> >   RS6K sitting next to my desk begging to run Jabber, but
> >   even IBM's porting efforts have only been partially
> >   successful.
> 
> Yup, you are correct. St. Peter mentioned that this work is
> being done. Bring out the cat o' nine tails.
> 
> >   Which, in many ways - is a pretty strong argument for
> >   much more platform-agnostic languages (perl, python,
> >   java), but I think we need to look at Apache as a good
> >   model.
> 
> Are you skipping on your Lithium again?
> 
> >   Yes, I know that Apache is only a server (well not so
> >   much these days) and Jabber is a set of related technologies, but
> >   I feel that making the current Jabber server as fast/friendly/portable
> >   as possible is the real key here, and maintaining a variety of
> >   separate server implementations would be...
> 
> Jabber = related technologies? That's not what I thought Jer had in mind.
> 
> >   On second thought - David Waite's right - we have to look at separating
> >   protocol from server implementation.
> 
> My point all along. Apache has the W3C. What does Jabber have? Do we
> need a separate jabber protocol effort separate from the server devel effort?
> 
> >   You know - I just contradicted myself.
> 
> I'm getting used to it.
> 
> --
> John Hebert
> System Engineer
> http://www.vedalabs.com
> Changing your state of mind through sound. 
> 
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